is Snowden's nomination for the Nobel Peace Prize worst ever?

[detour]

Originally Posted by oats

not being specific to the US I meant. central banking as a general practice.

my statement still stands...central banking an fiat currency revolve around creating money out of debt...the nation buys the currency from the central bank, with interest, an pays the debt in the same currency...it's a system designed to perpetuate the "rich get richer" idealogy...

in layman's terms, u agree to give me a dollar for $1.05...i have to pay u back with that same currency...thus, every dollar i get printed from u puts me $0.05 more in debt...i can never fully pay the debt cuz i have to get more money printed from u to pay it an that increases the debt...

plus, it puts the people at the bottom at the mercy of the central bank...the more money they print the less it is worth an inflation increases, meaning more money is needed...they print less money an it becomes more valuable but is less acquirable, meaning people are generally poorer...

look at the forced surrender of all gold by the american people...we were robbed basically at gun point for all of our actual wealth, an given worthless paper to replace it...people seem to forget that...an those kinds of practices are at the heart of central banking...the shit is a travesty...

[oats]

Originally Posted by detour

my statement still stands...central banking an fiat currency revolve around creating money out of debt...the nation buys the currency from the central bank, with interest, an pays the debt in the same currency...it's a system designed to perpetuate the "rich get richer" idealogy...

in layman's terms, u agree to give me a dollar for $1.05...i have to pay u back with that same currency...thus, every dollar i get printed from u puts me $0.05 more in debt...i can never fully pay the debt cuz i have to get more money printed from u to pay it an that increases the debt...

wait, let's talk about this in real terms. are you referring to inflation, or taxes, I'm not sure what you're talking about in specifics in that example of 1$ for 1.05.

Put it this way: you get a paycheck for $700 every two weeks for working somewhere (idk what you do tbh). How exactly are you indebted to anyone?

the switch to a floating currency from the gold standard, while a valid point, in reality had very little to do with central banking. one of the reasons why FDR devalued gold was because people started to horde it in the great depression, which made the economy completely halt (compounding the existing economic crises). our currency is hardly interfered with by the FED - only the Canadian dollar is more pure as a floating currency, and really that's a relatively new development because of our stimulus packages and quantitative easing in light of the recession. floating currency has proven to be far more productive for virtually every economy in the world, it's not a conspiracy lol.

I think you have a fundamentally incorrect understanding of the role of the FED, as well as how we came to our current state of inequality, which I'm in full agreement by the way inasmuch as how the cards are stacked in favor of people who are already rich. but that's more a result of policymaking and, what many economists believe, inherent pillars of capitalism.

[detour]

Originally Posted by Geo Oats

wait, let's talk about this in real terms. are you referring to inflation, or taxes, I'm not sure what you're talking about in specifics in that example of 1$ for 1.05.

Put it this way: you get a paycheck for $700 every two weeks for working somewhere (idk what you do tbh). How exactly are you indebted to anyone?

the switch to a floating currency from the gold standard, while a valid point, in reality had very little to do with central banking. one of the reasons why FDR devalued gold was because people started to horde it in the great depression, which made the economy completely halt (compounding the existing economic crises). our currency is hardly interfered with by the FED - only the Canadian dollar is more pure as a floating currency, and really that's a relatively new development because of our stimulus packages and quantitative easing in light of the recession. floating currency has proven to be far more productive for virtually every economy in the world, it's not a conspiracy lol.

I think you have a fundamentally incorrect understanding of the role of the FED, as well as how we came to our current state of inequality, which I'm in full agreement by the way inasmuch as how the cards are stacked in favor of people who are already rich. but that's more a result of policymaking and, what many economists believe, inherent pillars of capitalism.

i'm not talkin either...when the federal reserve, or a central bank, prints out money for a government, it charges that government to do so...if they print out one dollar in currency, they charge the government the one dollar for the money, plus a fee for loaning them the money...the fee isn't five cents, i just used that as an example...

in order to pay that debt back, the government has to either give them real currency, such as gold (in which case they surrender all their real wealth to the central bank), or they pay them back in cash plus interest for the loan...they give the US a dollar, charge them $1.05 for it, an in order to pay that dollar back, they have to have a printed dollar from the central bank...which they are charged another five cents for (keeping in mind that five cents is an arbitrary number here)...

the whole system revolves around debt...there's simply no way around it when it comes to central banking an fiat currency...every dollar that is printed automatically puts the government in debt to the agency that printed it, an it puts them in debt for a greater amount than the money is actually worth...

[detour]

Originally Posted by Geo Oats

the switch to a floating currency from the gold standard, while a valid point, in reality had very little to do with central banking. one of the reasons why FDR devalued gold was because people started to horde it in the great depression, which made the economy completely halt (compounding the existing economic crises). our currency is hardly interfered with by the FED - only the Canadian dollar is more pure as a floating currency, and really that's a relatively new development because of our stimulus packages and quantitative easing in light of the recession. floating currency has proven to be far more productive for virtually every economy in the world, it's not a conspiracy lol.

I think you have a fundamentally incorrect understanding of the role of the FED, as well as how we came to our current state of inequality, which I'm in full agreement by the way inasmuch as how the cards are stacked in favor of people who are already rich. but that's more a result of policymaking and, what many economists believe, inherent pillars of capitalism.

but the great depression was engineered by central bankers to put america in the position of needing the federal reserve...this isn't just some new conspiracy theory either, it's pretty well known that jp morgan was behind the economic collapse...

so yes, central banking came as part of the aftermath of the great depression, but the great depression was intentionally put into place by people who wanted to institute central banking...beyond that, if i want to spend my money an labor on collecting gold, that should be my choice...

i understand how the FED works...as i said above, they print a dollar...the government now owes them that dollar, plus an interest fee for the loan...to pay that back, u have to print more money...which puts u farther in the red...it's a perpetual cycle of debt designed to give bankers control of governments...

central banking was the main reason the pilgrims left england in the first place...our history books make it about religious freedom, but that's not really what was going on...the english government centralized all currency an the individual towns an villages an states, which had their own forms of currency, basically lost every bit of wealth they had, as their money was instantly deemed worthless...