How Big Is Space?

[PancakeBrah]

oats is smart

[oats]

@Mike Wrecka in regards to point A, many people believe that something to that nature will eventually happen (The Big Freeze, as it's been dubbed), though our knowledge of the history of the universe tends to disagree thus far. Meaning, the very fact that planets and galaxies exist at all is because of gravitational discrepancies from the Big Bang. If everything was distributed evenly, then heavier elements would have never crashed into/combined with lighter elements and formed any sort of order. The concept of planetary evolution itself flies in the face of thermodynamics, too, but that's neither here nor there. But to answer your question, matter is not equally dispersed, and likely never will be.

As far as point B is concerned, there are differing views. I think it was you who mentioned the Doppler Effect, that the universe is expanding (we know this by viewing the red shift of other objects in space, which indicates that things are moving away from us). The traditional scientists believes this is the ripple effect of the Big Bang, that the force of it caused everything to continue in motion, with no force to slow it down or stop it. Others believe there are white holes, which are pumping matter into the known universe and causing it to expand. Truth is, we don't know. Or at least, I don't know. In terms of space being barren, all space is barren. That's what I mean about the fundamentally flawed understanding of what space is - space is nothing, it's an absence. So yes, assuming the Big Bang happened, matter is moving into an infinite absence of matter, unless there are eventually other universes (which M Theory suggests). Again, we are still figuring out things like dark matter and antimatter, so our perspective of these things is extremely limited at this point.

[Mike Wrecka]

good shit oats. I tackle these type of questions more from a philosophy stand point without actually knowing much of the science involved.

but I think that you are thinking too much of the observable universe. the big bang could just be one of an infinite number of big bangs. we will never know. and that's why its fun to try to figure it out

[oats]

I think science is at its best when pursued with a sense of artistry and creativity. Problem is, most people skip the parts about actually knowing what they're talking about and go straight to the imaginative explanations of things. I call this "stoner science," and it is usually delivered with a false sense of certainty and authority, and it's annoying.

So I say to you, in all respect, that it is easier to focus on the philosophy of things than the actual science, probably because thoughts without any factual base are above criticism, whereas actual science can be debunked. I'd encourage you to start on the opposite end of the spectrum and earn the right to creativity. That's when it gets really fun.

That being said, I agree with what you're saying though. There could have been plenty of bangs, there could be virtually any other possibility you can imagine in this universe or the next. I'm just a little more interested in the things that can be supported by more than "it's not impossible."

[El Muffin]

My brain. It hurts

[uh-oh]

thats what i'm saying tho pay

that theory is retarded

mine is better

its some crazy space gold

math exists in everything, i refuse to believe there are weirdo spots where it doesnt

[Anjahl]

Originally Posted by uh-oh

thats what i'm saying tho pay

that theory is retarded

mine is better

its some crazy space gold

math exists in everything, i refuse to believe there are weirdo spots where it doesnt

Lol...then its on you to prove that there is matter out there made up of something other than atoms, because the gravity of a black hole is so great that it destroys them. Call me when you're revered as the second coming of sha'bat because of this.

Its not that math doesn't exist...just that math can't quantify it. A singularity is a point where math just doesn't work. So pretty much it's magic.




But word. I like your theory better. Super durable space gold sounds like something that would make us rich as FUCK.

[uh-oh]

Originally Posted by Anjahl

Lol...then its on you to prove that there is matter out there made up of something other than atoms, because the gravity of a black hole is so great that it destroys them.

ALLEGEDLY

the atoms of this specific metal could just be stupid strong

like the only difference between a steel bar and a sponge is how its atoms sit on eachother

its just some crazy dense shit where the atoms are snugger than we thought possible

so they aren't destroyed

there is a tiny piece of metal the size of the moon thats gravity is so strong it just sucks everything into it, and it "GROWING" is just all the stuff being smashed and rearranged on its surface

[Anjahl]

Originally Posted by uh-oh

ALLEGEDLY

the atoms of this specific metal could just be stupid strong

like the only difference between a steel bar and a sponge is how its atoms sit on eachother

its just some crazy dense shit where the atoms are snugger than we thought possible

so they aren't destroyed

there is a tiny piece of metal the size of the moon thats gravity is so strong it just sucks everything into it, and it "GROWING" is just all the stuff being smashed and rearranged on its surface

Atoms are atoms...they don't vary in strength...the density of the structures they make up and the EM bonding between them do. The gravity of a black hole is so strong that it eradicates ANY form of Em bonding and compresses those atoms into an area smaller than the atoms themselves. You're focusing on the matter part and ignoring the gravity part. Even IF matter was condensed to the point where where the atoms we're overlapping, it would not create a gravitational force that light cannot escape from.

What you are talking about exists...it is called a neutron star.

What you have to understand is that the particle carrier of the Em Force, which is what binds atoms, is the photon. Without that force, atoms cannot be bound together. If the gravity of a black hole is great enough to overcome light, it overcomes the structural integrity of atoms by default. Yes, Gravity "squishes" atoms together...than it utterly destroys them keeping only the mass of said matter. Oats or someone, please correct me if I'm wrong on this btw.

Literally, nothing exists beyond the sub-atomic uh-oh. It's an impossibility.
The very nature of atomic structure disallows it.

The center mass of a black hole is infinitely smaller than even a single atom, therefore it is a point at which matter cannot exist.

[uh-oh]

Originally Posted by Anjahl

Atoms are atoms...they don't vary in strength...the density of the structures they make up and the EM bonding between them do. The gravity of a black hole is so strong that it eradicates ANY form of Em bonding and compresses those atoms into an area smaller than the atoms themselves. You're focusing on the matter part and ignoring the gravity part. Even IF matter was condensed to the point where where the atoms we're overlapping, it would not create a gravitational force that light cannot escape from.

What you are talking about exists...it is called a neutron star.

What you have to understand is that the particle carrier of the Em Force, which is what binds atoms, is the photon. Without that force, atoms cannot be bound together. If the gravity of a black hole is great enough to overcome light, it overcomes the structural integrity of atoms by default. Yes, Gravity "squishes" atoms together...than it utterly destroys them keeping only the mass of said matter. Oats or someone, please correct me if I'm wrong on this btw.

Literally, nothing exists beyond the sub-atomic uh-oh. It's an impossibility.
The very nature of atomic structure disallows it.

The center mass of a black hole is infinitely smaller than even a single atom, therefore it is a point at which matter cannot exist.

nah you ain't understanding me

the atoms are so perfectly placed and arranged/bonded in this metal

the gravity FROM THIS rock, which is much bigger than a single atom, CRUSHES and dissassembles atoms from weaker matierials(everything known) and they become part of the metal itself

you follow?

you are talking about what a black hole does

i am talking about what the black hole IS

[Zombie]

I think it's finite.

AT the end doesn't have to be a brick wall. That's 3rd grade reasoning. Probably a portal that leads on the other side of space, like tons and hundreds of millions of billions of trillions lightyears away.

[Anjahl]

Originally Posted by Zombie

I think it's finite.

AT the end doesn't have to be a brick wall. That's 3rd grade reasoning. Probably a portal that leads on the other side of space, like tons and hundreds of millions of billions of trillions lightyears away.

It is finite...space is finite around a curvature of time which is infinite. Generally speaking if space is a sphere and you hit the end of it, you would then begin moving along that "wall" without ever perceiving it.

I just came up with that. Sounds dope though.

[PancakeBrah]

I think we're in a pendant on a cat's neck in a massive locker room tho

[Zombie]

+ anjahl sounds smarter than uh-oh so I agree with him.

Also coming from the guy that said LeBron could be the best NFL player ever so yeah anjahl >

[uh-oh]

never said that

i'ma put my hands in your butt

[uh-oh]

nah man you don't get it

the atoms are so strategically perfectly arranged that they aren't destroyed

its the super element of the universe

if i have one arrow, i can snap it over my knee, but if i have 20 arrows i can't snap them over my knee at once

science

[Anjahl]

Originally Posted by uh-oh

nah man you don't get it

the atoms are so strategically perfectly arranged that they aren't destroyed

its the super element of the universe

if i have one arrow, i can snap it over my knee, but if i have 20 arrows i can't snap them over my knee at once

science

You can't align anything into a space smaller than the parts that they are made of uh-oh. Point blank period...we don't know what happens to matter in a black hole, but we know it cant exist in any form we know of. You have to understand that the gravity at the center of a black hole is strong and changes so rapidly from the edge that it literally fucks relativity in the ass. If you were to go feet first into a blackhole, your legs would literally exist in a different time from your head. The very cohesion and concept of matter is rendered useless at that point.

You're talking about matter existing at a gravitational point smaller than the building blocks of that matter. You cant fit 4 quarters in a pinhole, I don't give a fuck how you stack them.

[Zen]

What is nothing?

[uh-oh]

Originally Posted by Zenland

What is nothing?

this beat i made like 6 years ago is relevant

http://limelinx.com/d43au

[uh-oh]

my theory>