Netcees  

Go Back   Netcees > Vault > Archives > The Netcees archive > AOWL Season 2 Archive

User Tag List

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 12-03-2013, 11:41 PM   #1
Certain
Mad fucking dangerous.
 
Certain's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 12,072
Battle Record: 40-19


Champed
- AOWL Season 3
- Art of Writing League (2x)

Rep Power: 85899402
Certain has a reputation beyond reputeCertain has a reputation beyond reputeCertain has a reputation beyond reputeCertain has a reputation beyond reputeCertain has a reputation beyond reputeCertain has a reputation beyond reputeCertain has a reputation beyond reputeCertain has a reputation beyond reputeCertain has a reputation beyond reputeCertain has a reputation beyond reputeCertain has a reputation beyond repute
Default Playoffs Round 1: No. 8 Mike Wrecka vs. No. 9 Diode - DIODE WINS 8-MINUS-2



WELCOME TO ROUND 1


Verses due: Sunday, Dec. 8, 11:59 p.m. PT

Voting deadline: Wednesday, Dec. 11, 11:59 p.m. PT

Line limits: 48 lines maximum unless agreed upon before either opponent posts a verse.

Requirement: Vote on all three first-round battles and post links in this thread. For each missing vote, two votes will be deducted.


Topic

Moment of Clarity


Good luck, @Diode and @Mike Wrecka.
__________________
I'm just swinging swords strictly based on keyboards, unbalanced like elephants and ants on seesaws.
Certain is offline  
Old 12-03-2013, 11:59 PM   #2
Mike Wrecka
WOW
 
Mike Wrecka's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 3,516
Battle Record: 29-25


Champed
- Writing Challenge League I

Rep Power: 82779335
Mike Wrecka has a brilliant futureMike Wrecka has a brilliant futureMike Wrecka has a brilliant futureMike Wrecka has a brilliant futureMike Wrecka has a brilliant futureMike Wrecka has a brilliant futureMike Wrecka has a brilliant futureMike Wrecka has a brilliant futureMike Wrecka has a brilliant futureMike Wrecka has a brilliant futureMike Wrecka has a brilliant future
Default

yup
__________________
A.bove T.he R.est
Mike Wrecka is offline  
Old 12-04-2013, 12:19 AM   #3
Diode
PR's Finest
 
Diode's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 14,156
Battle Record: 12-7



Rep Power: 85899406
Diode has a reputation beyond reputeDiode has a reputation beyond reputeDiode has a reputation beyond reputeDiode has a reputation beyond reputeDiode has a reputation beyond reputeDiode has a reputation beyond reputeDiode has a reputation beyond reputeDiode has a reputation beyond reputeDiode has a reputation beyond reputeDiode has a reputation beyond reputeDiode has a reputation beyond repute
Default

Mhm
__________________
Diode is offline  
Old 12-10-2013, 01:58 AM   #4
Certain
Mad fucking dangerous.
 
Certain's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 12,072
Battle Record: 40-19


Champed
- AOWL Season 3
- Art of Writing League (2x)

Rep Power: 85899402
Certain has a reputation beyond reputeCertain has a reputation beyond reputeCertain has a reputation beyond reputeCertain has a reputation beyond reputeCertain has a reputation beyond reputeCertain has a reputation beyond reputeCertain has a reputation beyond reputeCertain has a reputation beyond reputeCertain has a reputation beyond reputeCertain has a reputation beyond reputeCertain has a reputation beyond repute
Default Mike Wrecka's verse

picture a man who loved to read books, but hated people,
so he used to think thoughts that created evil,
his demeanor when confronted face to face was feeble,
until he woke up one day transformed into the shape of a beetle,
no wait, that's fake, it was in a short story he read,
too many distractions made things mixed up in his head,
see he longed for perpetual silence while wishing everyone dead,
when reality was harsh he embarked on a fantastic journey and fled,
but instead of getting away he dived right into the pages,
his collection of books was vast and extremely outrageous,
kept deep in his basement, was stacks wall to wall,
he reinforced it with steel so the towers wouldn't fall,
or collapse, matter of fact it was where he spent most of his time,
reading while dreaming and seeing explosions in his mind,
when he awoke and went upstairs he just wasn't prepared,
what he witnessed made him happy, while most would be scared,
his lair had fared better than all of the rest,
apocalyptic destruction left the world completely a mess,
Yes! now he was finally alone just him and his books,
the reinforced basement just minimally shook,
he had gotten his wish, all the distractions were gone,
delivered into bliss by this nuclear bomb,
he said "before I get started let me sit down for lunch",
and as he took a step he heard a loud crunch,
he had crushed his glasses, they were totally destroyed,
which meant he couldn't read, he was stuck in the void,
and no one was there to repair them, this was a personal hell,
he couldn't read without them, to his knees he fell,
in the end what he really needed was a friend,
to provide a moment of clarity allowing him to see again
Certain is offline  
Old 12-10-2013, 01:59 AM   #5
Certain
Mad fucking dangerous.
 
Certain's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 12,072
Battle Record: 40-19


Champed
- AOWL Season 3
- Art of Writing League (2x)

Rep Power: 85899402
Certain has a reputation beyond reputeCertain has a reputation beyond reputeCertain has a reputation beyond reputeCertain has a reputation beyond reputeCertain has a reputation beyond reputeCertain has a reputation beyond reputeCertain has a reputation beyond reputeCertain has a reputation beyond reputeCertain has a reputation beyond reputeCertain has a reputation beyond reputeCertain has a reputation beyond repute
Default Diode's verse

"moment of clarity"


i woke up to bombs, sirens, screams, and alarms
another day in the desert, never a minute from harm
but this was my life, and you've got to defend what you've got
so says the scripture's vivid pictures, restrictive or not..

now here's the plot:

that billowing smoke makes you choke so you better get air before your breathing's revoked
see the flames getting stoked and the sky which is soaked with a killer carcinogen by the name creosote
grab the gas mask and blast past the heat flash that leaves lashed burns and therm slashes
don't return or you'll be spurned by charred corpses interred to ashes


that may be a mouthful, but i'm explaining my point
this is how the hatred grows towards the fake foe that started this noise
and they know the real blow comes when the first of your family's murdered
and you go all in though the past shows that only retaliation is nurtured

thirty days in africa and ninety total spent in training
learning, stirring, reading, seething, practing, and hating
unwaning.. they feed you what you want to hear.
engraining.. the wicked words that are ringing in your ears.

then you board a special vessel that'll take you 'cross the way
a passport now provisioned with an escort and the funds to make them pay
no sir, no m'am, why yes, of course i speak good english
my birth certificate and papers? no problem! just here to visit!

florida feels familiar.. but for the humidity and sweat
and these rude and raucos citizens of the empire we'll unset
females flaunt their figures while their betters hide in bars
no signs of family, and their faithfulness is sparse

keeping all of this in mind makes the mission that much sweeter
though i know better than to revel in that joy (as a sharia believer)..
yet the captain calls me coarsely, for this manner, matter-of-fact
to certify certain committment, the fatwa's intent to act

this fast pass is first class amidst a manifest unseeming
my erst glance catches the pilot as he confers the flight's proceedings
and as we assess altimeters which confirm we've reached the ceiling
allahu akbar! fills the cabin, then a struggle, then some bleeding

we're veering right off vector, just as planned, restricted sector
the yoke and yaw conflicting with the rapid flashing sensors
i like to think this brings to mind a moment with a clear intended target
but the tower's floors just loom so large we'll toss aside that yardstick

now what happens next is better said by those with life to live
'cause it turns out when you're dead..

there's no clarity to give

Last edited by Certain; 12-10-2013 at 02:09 AM.
Certain is offline  
Old 12-10-2013, 04:14 AM   #6
zygote
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 502
Battle Record: 33-12

Accomplishments
- OM HOF (2x)

Champed
- Art of Writing League (3x)

Rep Power: 737825
zygote has a brilliant futurezygote has a brilliant futurezygote has a brilliant futurezygote has a brilliant futurezygote has a brilliant futurezygote has a brilliant futurezygote has a brilliant futurezygote has a brilliant futurezygote has a brilliant futurezygote has a brilliant futurezygote has a brilliant future
Default

MikeWrecka twilight zone themed v Diode united 93 themed. Both submissions integrate the topic in a novel and tangential way. Leaning towards Diode's moment of clarity as a zealous focus more so than MW's moment of clarity as an anti-social's paradise gone awry. In terms of execution, enjoyed MW's multiple rhyme schemes however the beginning "picture a..." didn't feel like the most effective way to start it, perhaps if you had kept it in more of a fantasy story format maybe that would have been an effective beginning, but you wrote in quite a realistic/grounded manner. I think also giving the character a name would have been a good touch, as he wasn't really an 'everyman' sort of character, so maybe a funny little name to play on the 'bookworm' stereotype would have been effective. Overall, it was a good story with some nice underlying themes (introversion and silence) tying into the topic.

Diode, less multiple rhymes but considering you placed the emphasis on other aspects of the writing I won't focus on that. There was a good use of precise adjectives to draw attention to the different scenes. E.g., 'billowing' smoke + 'raucous' citizens. If there is one thing I did not enjoy so much, it was the black and white nature of the character, the black and white ending with the judgement for the terrorist actions was perfect. However, I think for the character itself you could have created more room to maneuver by describing the 'indoctrination' scene more. E.g.,
"thirty days in africa and ninety total spent in training
learning, stirring, reading, seething, practicing, and hating
unwaning.. they feed you what you want to hear.
engraining.. the wicked words that are ringing in your ears." - Perhaps this small section was not so effective just as it was, maybe drawing in aspects of culture, tradition, family, history of imperialism and other things like that would have made it stronger. To make yes the actions of the character bad, but not necessarily the character themselves, at least initially. The beginning two lines were great in that way. Close one, but voting for Diode.
zygote is offline  
Old 12-10-2013, 10:26 AM   #7
Split
.
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 8,904
Battle Record: 27-22



Rep Power: 85899395
Split has a reputation beyond reputeSplit has a reputation beyond reputeSplit has a reputation beyond reputeSplit has a reputation beyond reputeSplit has a reputation beyond reputeSplit has a reputation beyond reputeSplit has a reputation beyond reputeSplit has a reputation beyond reputeSplit has a reputation beyond reputeSplit has a reputation beyond reputeSplit has a reputation beyond repute
Default

hm.

Mike Wrecka lifted/ redid the story from that one twilight zone episode.. I was just talking to someone about it actually lol. The theme was pretty straightforward, don't let your passion become you... or, be careful what you wish for. Either way, the focus was on how the man became so ensconced in his fantasies that he separated himself from the world. And when the world is gone, through the act of smashing his glasses, he discovers that he truly has nothing

Of course, beneath the surface this is also implying that the man had nothing before the world-ending disaster as well.

aside from this visceral moment of clarity, there was not much development or characterization or personal spin added to the framework of the story that was provided to you. You can obv drop some serious story pieces (it seems to be your focus and advantage in these marches) so it would have been nice to see you embellish the themes a bit.

The rhyming was smooth and subtle. very nice. you didn't make it overstated or more complex than it needed to be, easy reading.




Diode wrote about a modern-day suicide-bomber jihadist. I think that the take was pretty unique and interesting to begin with. Not what i was expecting from Rd 1 playoffs

I did not like the italicized section. It seemed to me to be a sloppy description of either hell, the man's birthplace, or the suicide bombing journey..
.. maybe it is noting that their ultimate fate is not so different from what they would experience in their home country.

i think you did a good job describing the actions in a blow-by-blow manner.

finally, the ending was by far the best part.

it ties in the death of family members mentioned before, and the descriptions of the emotions and anticipations of the jihadists from before their final mission.

The idea that Death brings no clarity to its victims is contrary to the sugar-coated idealism that many Westerners hold dear... and perhaps can be seen as one of the greater divides between the fracturing Christian religions and the rock-solid, more traditional Islam.

And it is true that your main character had already seen his clarity. His unquestioning dedication is a reflection of the hard roads he and his people walked. While you do not make any effort to make your character relatable or even a protagonist, the death and destruction he delivered fulfilled their purpose in spreading this solemnity to those he felt lived without it. And through this, brought an appreciation of life- rather an understanding of death- to people unaffected by its pull


In the end, despite bad (bad) wording, flow, and rhymes, Diode articulated quite an advanced set of themes and ideas. Though i do prefer Zygote's rendition on religious extremists.


I'm surprised by this.... because after my initial read-throughs it appeared that MW had won with a no-show verse... but despite quite unsuperior mechanics and delivery, i believe Diode took this battle in its entirety. Mike Wrecka's verse seemed very uninspired by comparison.

good read.

V/ Diode
__________________
http://split8.yolasite.com
Split is offline  
Old 12-10-2013, 01:12 PM   #8
NYCSPITZ
SYRACUSE
 
NYCSPITZ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 4,033
Battle Record: 31-37


Champed
- Write Night II
- Alias Topical Tournament

Rep Power: 4743543
NYCSPITZ has a brilliant futureNYCSPITZ has a brilliant futureNYCSPITZ has a brilliant futureNYCSPITZ has a brilliant futureNYCSPITZ has a brilliant futureNYCSPITZ has a brilliant futureNYCSPITZ has a brilliant futureNYCSPITZ has a brilliant futureNYCSPITZ has a brilliant futureNYCSPITZ has a brilliant futureNYCSPITZ has a brilliant future
Default

MW flipped that twilight zone ep but instead of a library the dude with glasses was in his basement. It was a cool flip to see in rhyme format but I have seen MW drop way better than this. Diode did some 9/11 shit and his story was more fleshed out to me. His is from the mainstream perspective that muslim extremists committed 9/11 and wanted 30 virgins and all that. Untrue, 9/11 was clearly an inside job, probably a drone plane but neither of us will give an inch to the other on the topic so why bother arguing about it? I liked diode's verse more this week

V/ diode
NYCSPITZ is offline  
Old 12-11-2013, 08:04 PM   #9
PancakeBrah
SOBER
 
PancakeBrah's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 13,052
Battle Record: 2-5


Champed
- AOWL Season 2

Rep Power: 85899406
PancakeBrah has a reputation beyond reputePancakeBrah has a reputation beyond reputePancakeBrah has a reputation beyond reputePancakeBrah has a reputation beyond reputePancakeBrah has a reputation beyond reputePancakeBrah has a reputation beyond reputePancakeBrah has a reputation beyond reputePancakeBrah has a reputation beyond reputePancakeBrah has a reputation beyond reputePancakeBrah has a reputation beyond reputePancakeBrah has a reputation beyond repute
Default

I have to say, doing the Admin/Mod drop for verses in a topical league is offputting to me.

Moment of Clarity.

Mike Wrecka:

I didn't like the concept. I remember reading a previous verse from you based on Jack and Jill. The difference between that piece and this, though, is that you made the Jack and Jill story your own with a left field take on it. This was just a retelling without much flair. I thought the wording was a bit clunky in a few spots (I can expand further if you care) and the rhymes/schemes were pretty standard. This was a solid effort and I was interested in reading it to see how you'd flip it but in the end it was all a bit lackluster for me. The last couple lines where you tied in the topic was pretty good but didn't save the verse for me.

Diode:

Pretty good. You finished stronger than you started which is unusual for topicals/open mics in my experience. You had some tricks with your schemes here and there that were nice but on the other hand your rhyme wording was off at other spots, mostly towards the beginning. This type of story has been done before so it's all in the telling and I think you had a nice balance of reality/grit and levity. These two sections in particular

"keeping all of this in mind makes the mission that much sweeter
though i know better than to revel in that joy (as a sharia believer)..
yet the captain calls me coarsely, for this manner, matter-of-fact
to certify certain committment, the fatwa's intent to act

this fast pass is first class amidst a manifest unseeming
my erst glance catches the pilot as he confers the flight's proceedings
and as we assess altimeters which confirm we've reached the ceiling
allahu akbar! fills the cabin, then a struggle, then some bleeding"

were well paced without a single slip up in terms of rhythm or wording. Your ending was good for the piece. Overall this was a pretty cohesive effort that picked up steam as it went. Reading through your verse again I think you write better during action as opposed to exposition. As soon as the piece dove into the actual act and you were describing the situation instead of setting it up it became more interesting. Then again this is just one piece so who knows but going forward I would advise writing in that tone for success.

Pretty good match here. I think Mike left a little bit of creativity on the table. Skill wise I think you both are pretty close but Diode got it this time around. Look forward to more from each in the future.

v/Diode
__________________
If I ventured in the slipstream
Between the viaducts of your dreams
Where immobil steel rims crack
And the ditch in the back road stop
Could you find me?
PancakeBrah is offline  
Old 12-11-2013, 10:03 PM   #10
breathless
Master of Beastiality
 
breathless's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Lansing, Mi
Posts: 368
Battle Record: 4-6



Rep Power: 0
breathless breathless breathless breathless breathless breathless breathless breathless breathless breathless breathless
Default

Mike - not bad, but honestly, nothing really wowed me here, the part about the beetle transformation threw me off, maybe I'm just missing the allusion reference. But yea, a lot of the rhymes were sorta basic, read, dead, head, with arbitrary multis to brighten them up. It read sort of stop and go for me with some syllabic dissonance that didn't have conducive counterparts to make em harmonize

Diode - even though this was basically some 9/11 shit,,it provided more backstory on the terrorist, his mundane thoughts (florida weather and such) that was pleasing, humanized the bad guy some. The piece was complete, start to end, and the death being the instant of clarity was a nice way to finish it

Vote - Diode
__________________
I used to be amazing...

http://soundcloud.com/dancourser/sets
breathless is offline  
Old 12-11-2013, 11:22 PM   #11
patrown
‹^›ô¿ô‹^›
 
patrown's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 596
Battle Record: 13-19



Rep Power: 0
patrown patrown patrown patrown patrown patrown patrown patrown patrown patrown patrown
Send a message via AIM to patrown
Default

mw- i enjoyed the piece. just didn't really connect with it. wanted more from some places, thought a few word choices were odd. but i still felt your effort. strange turn of events. i got a feeling this is some kind of metaphor i'm unable to grasph ahold of. lines like this..
the reinforced basement just minimally shook,
felt a little off to me. i liked these though..

kept deep in his basement, was stacks wall to wall,
he reinforced it with steel so the towers wouldn't fall,
or collapse, matter of fact it was where he spent most of his time,
reading while dreaming and seeing explosions in his mind,

good drop.

diode- "breathing's revoked" threw me off a little bit.
and i really enjoyed these three..
learning, stirring, reading, seething, practing, and hating
unwaning.. they feed you what you want to hear.
engraining.. the wicked words that are ringing in your ears.
can't say i didn't see it coming @ sharia. still.. you told the story well. would've liked a little bit more of some twisted ideals, or some kind of self justification. it was told matter of fact, and i would've liked a bit more drama from your subject.

/v diode - storytelling goes a long way sometimes.
patrown is offline  
Old 12-12-2013, 01:27 AM   #12
Certain
Mad fucking dangerous.
 
Certain's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 12,072
Battle Record: 40-19


Champed
- AOWL Season 3
- Art of Writing League (2x)

Rep Power: 85899402
Certain has a reputation beyond reputeCertain has a reputation beyond reputeCertain has a reputation beyond reputeCertain has a reputation beyond reputeCertain has a reputation beyond reputeCertain has a reputation beyond reputeCertain has a reputation beyond reputeCertain has a reputation beyond reputeCertain has a reputation beyond reputeCertain has a reputation beyond reputeCertain has a reputation beyond repute
Default

Mike Wrecka: I don't have a problem with retelling a well-known story, and most of the voters recognized this one. But I do think that upon doing so, you must really up the ante on your writing. Providing a new twist or new bit of background on a character would be a good step. Basically, you have to understand that your verse will be taken in context of the source material, which then puts the pressure on you to step it up. Your slight twist was that the man who reads actively hated everyone and dreamed they would die, whereas the original story was that he was an unbelievably nice guy who had a really hard life. I think that change was a bit of a mistake because it made us unable to root for your character. The beauty of that episode of The Twilight Zone is in the way it made the audience so happy for the man that the rest of the world dying a terrible (if unseen) death actually seemed like a good thing. The darker version you presented here made me actively dislike this character, whom I probably easily could have related to as an introvert who loves to read and rarely has enough time for it all. The ironic twist felt more like a stern lesson about evil thoughts than an example of life's unbridled cruelty. I also thought you could have mentioned the glasses before the last line, since they're such an important part of the story. The Twilight Zone actor wore huge glasses so that they became his defining character trait. The writing itself was typical Mike Wrecka stuff. You keep things clear and moving and your flow is flawless but simple. So there's not much in the way of flourishes, which also could have helped raise the bar a bit given the retelling aspect of the topic. But the strongest point of this was its relation to the topic. Put simply, using this story as an entry point for a moment of clarity was very nice.

Diode: The mind-of-the-terrorist stuff has been done before, and this was not a particularly fresh take on it. It's interesting you took umbrage with his retelling of a story, then did the same. I understand the difference, particularly if Mike Wrecka were to have received credit from voters for creativity in the plot. But he didn't, and you won't either. Your verse was all about the details, and some sections of that were done well. I think your resentment made you cast this character as a bit two-dimensional, though. He was sort of the archetype terrorist, rather than a unique-thinking person who made a decision that felt correct to him. That's not to say you're wrong, but a verse making us understand better why the terrorist did what he did would have been more difficult and more interesting. But you countered the issue by being detailed. The pace picked up when our character gets on the plane to Florida. Your weak rhymes can be pretty problematic, particularly because you have no room to breath on slant rhymes when you're only rhyming a single syllable. The second-person narration was an interesting choice. It paid off in the end, I suppose, though I'm not sure I liked that ending. Inverting the topic just for that finish made it feel a little forced. I'm of the belief that the best topical verses are the ones that truly define the topic, that can only fit one topic and fit that topic perfectly.

This vote is as tough as I expected it to be. Mike Wrecka hit the topic better. But Diode outwrote him and told a more complete story. But Mike Wrecka had better rhymes and overally mechanics. But Diode used more poetic devices and had more stylistic writing. Both of you were way too judgmental against your main characters. Both of you have written better verses. But I came away more impressed with Diode here. Had Mike Wrecka fleshed out his character a bit more with a stronger back story, he would have won this even without changing what he already had written. But while neither character was humanized well, that was less important to Diode's verse, which served more as a journalistic story built on methodology and less as an emotionally driven story.

Vote: Diode
__________________
I'm just swinging swords strictly based on keyboards, unbalanced like elephants and ants on seesaws.
Certain is offline  
Old 12-12-2013, 02:08 AM   #13
Frank
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 3,228



Champed
- NWL Season 2
- Art of Writing League (5x)
- Lime Green Poetry Association
- AOWL Season 6
- AOWL Season 10

Rep Power: 3853343
Frank has a brilliant futureFrank has a brilliant futureFrank has a brilliant futureFrank has a brilliant futureFrank has a brilliant futureFrank has a brilliant futureFrank has a brilliant futureFrank has a brilliant futureFrank has a brilliant futureFrank has a brilliant futureFrank has a brilliant future
Default

Certain verse 1

I did not see the episode. Was it a rip off of a sitcom episode ?or was it just another episode in Certain verse #1's production of simple stories with fairytale kid endings. This verse ran in line with Certain verse # 1's story about ketchup on jeans. Apocalyptic destruction, nuclear bomb, glasses are crushed - more heavy hard hitting wordplay to make glasses crushed sound devastating. Certain verse #1 was decent.

Certain verse 2

Verse read like a blurr to me now as I try to recall it. That could be your intentions here, I never quite get a minute of focus here until Allauh Akbar enters the cabin, at which point, the plane is going down. Certain verse #2 was written like it was written on a tray table with a crayon during a violent turbulence, Well done.


Vote goes to Certain verse #2
__________________
VETWORK
Frank is offline  
Closed Thread

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 09:55 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2024 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Google+