Originally Posted by VERITAS (Post 88226)

When the Bible says that "we are not appointed to wrath" what wrath does it mean?

Originally Posted by Coup (Post 88192)

the dragon stood before the people of Ysrael (those who worship in spirit and in truth) and he is waiting to devour the seekers of the Most High, he is not worried about the others because they already have his image..

Originally Posted by Battle Hymens (Post 88314)

The bible is not real nor is it remotely close to the truth about how humans came to be.
All religions are cults and all the prophets from the pass/now were/are cult leaders.

Let me ask you this: was Jesus a white man? No
Did Jesus establish his church? No
Was Constantine a christian? No. He saw religion (like the previous Caesars before him) as a mind control device to divert the masses attention and anger. I believe around this time in early Christianity, Christians were being slaughtered by the boat loads.

Was Paul true to Jesus Christ teachings? No


Don't let me get started on Muslims, Jews, ect

Fuck the Abrahamic religions

Originally Posted by Coup (Post 88312)

Great questions...very good.

just saw @VERAITS reply...will be back with a bullet proof understanding ont out the words of Paul but out of scriptures, Paul knew there was no such thing as rapture...

also I will provide you what Paul is saying as he drew all understanding from scripture..you gotta keep in mind Paul was writing to gentiles whom were coming into the covenant, whom still worship pagan idols, he was teaching them...keep an historic mind and a Hebrew mindset..Paul was Hebrew form the tribe of Benjamen.

These same idols those Gentiles worshiped then, they do today...the wraped them all around scripture, thus pagainzing it.


Rapture is satan's doctrine to make you asleep
this is a pagan christian doctrine...

Originally Posted by Battle Hymens (Post 88314)

The bible is not real nor is it remotely close to the truth about how humans came to be.
All religions are cults and all the prophets from the pass/now were/are cult leaders.

Let me ask you this: was Jesus a white man? No
Did Jesus establish his church? No
Was Constantine a christian? No. He saw religion (like the previous Caesars before him) as a mind control device to divert the masses attention and anger. I believe around this time in early Christianity, Christians were being slaughtered by the boat loads by Romans.

Was Paul true to Jesus Christ teachings? No


Don't let me get started on Muslims, Jews, ect

Fuck the Abrahamic religions

Originally Posted by VividEnds (Post 88327)

I think your problems are with Christians not Christianity

Originally Posted by VERITAS (Post 88250)

hold up fam.....If you believe the rapture is a lie then perhaps you should build yours to mine.

now:

answer me: what wrath is it that we are not appointed to?


1 thess 5:9 For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,


also let me ask you: who shall not die?

1 cor 15:51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,


especiallay since the bible says that it is appointed once for every man to die?


so answer me this: 1. what wrath is it that we are not appointed to? I say that we are not appointed to the wrath of GOD which is the tribulation period aka four sets of 7 judgements all getting progressively worse

and 2. who shall not sleep? I say it is the church, the called out body, ecclesia.


answer please:

Originally Posted by Coup (Post 88418)

Fam, take this slow...I don't care who is right...we are not to justify ourselves. So read through this slow and consider.

Like many world religions and like many Christians, your understanding and knowledge of truth only exist in the confides of Letters in the so called New Testament. This is your first great error. We must remember that MessiYAH and the 12 and Paul all taught through the Torah lens. You cannot begin to understand the "bible' unless you shake your pagan mindset (christain mindset) and see it how these Hebrews saw it.

The prophet Isaiah tells us that doctrine has to be established:


Isaiah 28:9-10


Well ???

You provided in ignorance (not knowing) 1 Cor 15:51 as a verse to support a doctrine that is not in the "bible", but only in the hearts of deceived men and woman.



Paul is referring to the great and terrible day. The sound of the trumpet will single this...this trump he refers to starts the first seal which is explained in Revelations chapter 6. Not not rapture where you vanish in mid air to where ? The Kingdom is coming down from heaven to earth forever. The earth was not created in vain. Nither will Abba Yah's word come back to him in vain.

The wrath of the tribulations will purify his body of believers that are found in MessiYAH...But know you WILL go through tribulations if you be in that time...make no mistake. You have to be pure and tested to be found worthy to enter the narrow gates of the Kingdom and to go to the wilderness first to learn the way under the King Yahshua. The Broadway to destruction is the world's religion and what they are teaching you.

Matter of fact, the Feast of Trumpets is a High Day of Elohim that also foreshadows the great day. All his High Days do, fore in all his law is a teaching of his way. The Father uses trumpets to sound everything...it's all over scripture.

Isaiah speaks of this time, when Yahuwah will gather up Ysrael again..at the sound of THAT TRUMPET

Isaiah 27:12-13


This of course has not happened yet.

His place on earth is Jerusalem. Even in Genesis, before Jerusalem became Jerusalem, it was Salem, where Yahuwah had a preist their after the order of meshedaik, the king of Salem.

Joel 2:1


He is speaking of that day.

The angles will be with MessiYAH to tear the wheat from the chaff...those appointed to wrath and those going to the wilderness...

Revelation 8:6


IT GETS DEEP. THIS IS A BREIF OUTLINE...I have much to cover.

//

To show you that when we did we are really asleep spiritually. Consider a when MessiYAH rose Lazarous from the dead.

John 11



In Yahshua's understanding he was not dead, rather asleep until the great resurrection of us all on the time appointed, not know rapture.. He finally spoke carnally and to the peoples understanding and said, yeah he's dead. But in reality we don't die. We just return to the earth.

If Lazarus was in Heaven, he must of been looking down saying, "OH MAN not again...I have to come out of the Kingdom to go back to that evil place!!" lol

I can provide many more accounts and witness in scripture...but just know MessiYAH came in the volume of the "books" or the Torah (instructions). He was a walking Torah and you must remember that, he taught the will of the Father, which is to obey Him at every word.


-How we are not appointed to wrath. This is found in YAHUWAH's salvation: Yahshua the MessiYAH (which means YAH's Salvation)...in English Joshua.

-What is wrath and how we escape it ?...it's called Grace. Grace is our liberty or freedom of the judgments for breaking YAH's everlasting laws. There were two sets of laws. The law and the judgements for breaking them. MessiYAH frees us from not keeping the law, but judgements for them.




Here is an amazingly simple teaching in the Bible that is rarely taught.

It is concerning the law that was done away with through Yahshua's sacrifice. Here is also the true teaching which pertains to GRACE.

Hebrews 7:12-14



This 7th chapter of Hebrews pertain to Yahshua becoming the High Priest through him becoming the sacrifice, fulfilling what was prophecied of him. He is literally the lamb of Elohim (God).



Yahshua came out of the tribe of Judah not out of the priest tribe of Levi.

Psalms 110 prophecied of this. But with the change of the priesthood also came a change of the laws which pertained to the Levitical priesthood. To put it plain, there were two set of laws in the Old Testament. The one set are the commandments of Elohim and the other set is the laws that you was placed under (the JUDGEMENTS) for breaking the aforementioned commandments. Let's read the BIBLICAL definition of what sin is.

1 John 3:4-5


(WHY?)




We see here that sin means "transgression of the law". Any act that is contrary to Yahuwah's commandments is sin. Yahshua came to take away our sin because all men have sinned, and unless you become justified by the blood of Messiah, you are still in your sins and you are subject to the judgements of those sins. Now in the Old Testament, there was various judgements for various sins that the Levitical priesthood presided over. When you transgressed a sin not unto death, then you had to offer up sin offerings through the Levitical priesthood. But a transgression that was a part of the 10 commandments usually meant that the sinner had to die...without mercy/GRACE.

In Exodus 20 We see the Ten Commandments. But let's read the very next chapter

Exodus 21:1,12,17,24


Here, we see just a portion of that second set of laws called the
JUDGEMENTS. In the book of Leviticus you can read about the sins which required sin offerings/sacrifices. All of these JUDGEMENTS were what Yahshua's sacrifice delivered us from giving us GRACE.

Romans 6:12-16



Paul is saying something here that goes completely UNNOTICED. He said to not let sin reign in your body and to yield it unto Elohim as instruments of RIGHTEOUSNESS. You can't be an instrument of righteousness if you're not keeping the commandments of Yahuwah.



Paul is saying here that you are NOT under the death sentence that came from Adam. We will read about that later. We have received GRACE from the JUDGEMENTS that we were under according to the Old Covenant.

Now here's the thing. People misconstrue this to mean that we don't have to keep the commandments. No! You are NOT delivered from the laws of Yahuwah. You were delivered from the laws/JUDGEMENTS you were under for BREAKING those laws. Look at what Paul says in the next verse.



A prisoner receives parole from prison which is grace, NOT because he earned it, but because he had a powerful attorney/intercessor that delivered him from UNDER THE LAW. This prisoner sinned and he should have faced the JUDGEMENT but he was delivered. Upon his release, he asks his lawyer, shall I go back and commit the crime again now that I'm not under the law but under grace? The intercessor says, "Elohim forbid!!"
Think about it


Well???...

..Don't you know that?

Whatever actions you take whether you acknowledge it or not...if you keep Yah's commandments you are Yah's servant fulfilling the first AND greatest commandment. But if you follow after the rudiments of this world and the traditions of men, then you are a servant of ANOTHER Elohim. Yep... Satan himself,...regardless of who name you call upon.



And it don't stop...

Galatians 3:10-13,19-24


Why is no man justified in the sight of Elohim?

Because we have all sinned that's why. No matter how much you keep the commandments you still have to be justified from the sins that you had commited in the past. For ALL have sinned.



...Messiah hath redeemed us from the CURSE OF THE LAW, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is everyone that hangeth on a tree:

Hanging was also a judgement that was a penalty for sin. Yahshua was penalized for OUR sins.



In the next passage we shall see that sin can't be imputed if there is no law. So with that being the case, there was another set of laws as we saw above which was added because of transgressions. And these laws were none other than the JUDGEMENT laws. We were under these judgements which were our schoolmaster until Messiah came. Now, apply what you have learned to this next passage and watch how Paul's words flow.

Romans 5:18-21



Now theologians/pastors/laymen read this passage and think that Messiah's death, which was a FREE GIFT/GRACE, means that we are not under the commandments.

No.

You are not under the JUDGEMENT which was the condemnation of death.

Ok,...so I would have to ask that now that you have partook of the free gift/GRACE, shall you continue in sin or must you start living a new way? Paul asks this same question in the next chapter.

Romans 6:1-7,12-18



Paul's answer:




How can you, or anyone else that is dead to sin, live any longer in sin, which as we read, was the transgression of the law.

How can you come under Yahshua's blood and still not keep the sabbath?

...and STILL eat pig and other abominations?

....and STILL talk about "Jesus was born on Decemeber 25?......and STILL put a tree/idol up in your living room?

Let's continue this chapter

Know ye not that so many of us were baptized into Yahshua HaMashiach were baptized into his death?

Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Messiah was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should WALK in the newness of life.

For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, WE SHALL

ALSO BE IN THE LIKENESS OF HIS RESURRECTION:
Knowing this, that our old man is CRUCIFIED with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin...

That adulterous, lying, idolotrous, pig-eating, Sunday morning-keeping, etc., etc., man/woman is DEAD! If he is dead then you are henceforth not serving sin. No ifs, and, or buts about it!



This is something that YOU have to do! Bust that rhetoric that those holier-than-thou people be talking about saying, "The holy spirit keeps me walking in Elohim." Yea...I'm like, "Show that to me in the book!" But at anyrate, this letter of Paul's is FLOWING! Let's look at a portion of the letter Paul wrote to the Colossians who were newly delivered from sin and the pagan lifestyle of their people.

Colossians 2:6-16



Who were the philosophers in Paul's day? The Gentiles (Greeks and Romans) that's who. Their culture as them being the world rulers dictated what the traditions of men and the rudiments of the world were, just as present-day Christianity IS filled with traditions that came out of these Gentile idolatrous cultures.



He's telling these Greeks, that not in Zeus, Apollo, Mithra, Easter (heh) and Diana does the Elohimhead exist, neither are they Elohims, but in the Elohim of Israel are these Greeks saved. Yes, this is a deep letter but it's very clear when you read it in context.

And ye are complete in him, which is the head of ALL

(ALL, absolutely ALL...including Nero, Caligula, and all the other Gentile rulers of the day.)



(Cuz they have been done away with?...No, Because



Paul is telling these newly-converted Greeks to not let any man, and especially people of their own race which were the rulers, philosophers, and idolators, to judge them because they have took hold of the covenant of the Elohim of Israel which includes all those things that they would be judged by. Now, let's look at the ordinance that was against us.

Hebrews 10:26-28



HERE is that law which was against us and contrary to us.
The JUDGEMENT laws.

We had to die and unless Yahshua was made a sacrifice for the world, the Gentiles which were idolators among other things, could have never ever became a part of the "commonwealth of Israel".

Finally, let's look at one more passage. This is when they brought an adulterer to Yahshua.

John 8:1-11



Keep in mind here that had that woman not committed adultery, she would not have at this point,been put UNDER THE LAW...she needs some GRACE real quick or she will die.

And they which heard it, being CONVICTED by their OWN conscience, went out one by one, beginning at the eldest, even unto the last: and Jesus was left alone, and the woman standing in the midst.

Yahshua had just made intercession for this woman even before he BECAME the intercessor. Also note that had this woman given the option to sacrifice a bull or a goat as a JUDGEMENT for her sin, she would have happily done it. The sacrifices were not the ordinance that was contrary to us. Death was.

When Yahshua had lifted up himself, and saw none but the woman, he said unto her, Neither do I condemn thee: GO, and SIN NO MORE.

Right there, Yahshua not only showed you which law was abolished, but he also showed you that you cannot continue in sin so that grace may abound. I'm sure that adulteress understood that perfectly! And...I hope you do too!

Grace & Peace in Yahshua

Originally Posted by Battle Hymens (Post 88361)

I have issues with both Baptists and Catholics... and the history of Christianity because of how violent their cause has been ever since its inception. I find it quite ironic when I hear right wing baptist claim that Muslims are very violent when in the 60s they were the same people burning down black churches. And if you want to go further back before Jim Crow there was slavery. No one wants to mention that holocaust.


And I find it annoying when Christians claim that they treated their slaves better than Muslims. I mean, should we even consider that to be a rationale argument? This is why I think Christianity is slowly dissolving because of its own self destructive traits.

I mean, if your pro life, why kill abortion clinic doctors? Why cut back public school funding if you're pro life? and there's more I can pull from out my magic hat.


But here's my biggest beef with all three religions. I'm a Palestinian, and yet, I'm consider to the world as an nomad, a gypsy, not as a political refugee, not a native whose ethnicity suffered its own silent "holocaust" because Ultra-orthodox Christians and Ultra-orthodox Jews claimed that "Jews" were now an ethnicity and needed to be given their "rightful" land back. You don't see the Americans giving back their land to the Native Americans.

Recently, the Israel government found in west Jerusalem a hidden ***he that was filled with thousands of dead Palestinians. This was the result of their expulsion back in 1948 which nearly all the world governments had a hand in it. But there's no mention of that in the history books. No mention as to what was the result of those poor Jews who had suffered from Hitler's hand taking over a land that wasn't theres ever. They became what they feared the most.

and the only people who push the zionist agenda are christians and jews. What people don't know that during WW2 Zionist Jews were working for Nazis in hopes of establishing a modern day Israel so that they can bring the second coming of christ a lot closer along with jewish genocide (it says in relevations there'll be a small number of jews who will survive). that's why you have a lot of christian churches and donation groups flooding Israel with funds. the absurdity of this alone says wonders about us as a species.

Originally Posted by Split Eight (Post 88424)

Literally read nothing after I realized you don't know the difference between theology and cultism

Originally Posted by Battle Hymens (Post 88428)

They are both one and the same, dumbass. Jesus Christ was just as crazy as Jim Jones. The only difference is: Jesus was more compassionate and didn't want to lose supporters so he can have a place to stay whereas Jim Jones wanted followers so that they can kill themselves along with himself because he wanted attention.

Originally Posted by Split Eight (Post 88431)

Jesus Christ isn't important, the story is...